Allies, get your Allies whiles they're still fresh
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Allies, get your Allies whiles they're... Expand / Collapse
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1/22/2004 3:57 PM


I am pot

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My 2nd post on these forums... yay!

The comments I've got from my little story seem to suggest that very few people play a diplomatic game like I do. Theres always 1 or maybe 2 civilizations out there that can make great allies, from anything to assisting you in a war or simply sharing techs and trading resources. Remember the vote to end the game is 1 vote per civ and has nothing to do with your culture or power.

To gain these allies... Usually when you have luxury resources you'll have 6-8 of them extra sitting around doing nothing. When trade finally becomes possible with all nations (navigation) very few nations will actually be able to pay any amount of gold per turn for your luxuries. So what else do you do with them? Make some friends. A civilization thats annoyed with you becomes polite after recieving 20 turns of free silks, horses, or some other somewhat useless to you but very helpful to them resource. Remember, if your going for an ally giving them gunpowder is a good thing.

The nation you choose to do this with is also a big factor. Never try to ally yourself with a nation larger than you (or near the same size). Go for one thats slightly smaller and perhaps a bit less technologically advanced. A civilization stranded on their own island is a good start. Preferably find one thats also being threatened by another nation (in my game I used the byzantines as they were low tech and being threatened by the much larger celtics).

Now your asking me why not just crush the low tech/low powered civ rather then allying with it. Well, quite simply they are more effective on their own then under your control. If you were to take those cities they would make 0 cash and 1 production with the rest as corruption. And what better way to combat a cheating AI by siccing one of the cheating AI's on it.

And one final comment, some civilizations will ally themselves with you quicker then others. As a dumb (but mostly correct) rule of thumb, if it has a female leader, they will be more receptive to your ally offers. French, Spanish, Byzantines, and Egyptians are the ones I try to pick out when I can. It's more coincidence that they have female leaders, but hey if it works (when in rome hey?). They just have lower agression ratings then other civilizations. Never try to ally with a militaristic civlization, it just doesn't work.

This strategy is used on Demi-God skill level... I'm unsure how it would work on other skill levels, but I imagine it would be easier talking them into a protection pact on easier difficulties.
1/22/2004 6:28 PM


Prince of The JODASA

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Very interesting.
1/22/2004 8:08 PM


Second Lieutenant

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I always make close allies during the game. However, I find that my allies change throughout the game.

Initially, I usually like to make good friends with someone on my same contenent. Preferably the AI farthest away on the same contenent. This will help me in times of war. When it is just me and them left on the contenent, I will start getting friendly with another civ on another contenent and attack my former ally.

When I control my Contenent, I then use my new friend to wage war on their contenent aganst a weaker AI. Once I have a strong hold on thier contenent, I will go for the domination victory.

Every game is different though, and I find no set of plans ever work out. I play at Emperor and Deity levels, and find I may have a polite friend one turn, and the next turn they are Annoyed with me. :confused:

1/22/2004 10:08 PM
Beanaterian

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5/20/2004 9:23 PM


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Now your asking me why not just crush the low tech/low powered civ rather then allying with it. Well, quite simply they are more effective on their own then under your control. If you were to take those cities they would make 0 cash and 1 production with the rest as corruption. And what better way to combat a cheating AI by siccing one of the cheating AI's on it.


Wow, I never tought of that. If I was playing your game the Byzantines would have been dead along time ago. I usually try to go for Domination. But this would be useful if you intend on wining by Spaceship.

BTW, I notice that in this game, it is basically all of them versus you. In Civ II(or CivI), the AI bashed each other's heads straight from the beginning. I miss that.
1/23/2004 10:19 AM


I am pot

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Well, unfortunately very often if you've stopped giving them gifts (the 20 turns of the resource you've given them expires) they will go back from polite to annoyed, assuming you haven't taken any steps other than that gift.

What I notice is all civs start as annoyed towards you (almost all, those few I pointed out will often be polite).
Annoyed plus gift (sometimes needs 2 gifts) = polite
Polite + any military alliance = gracious
Annoyed + expired gift + right of passage = polite

after you give a gift and get them to polite, always try for a right of passage and any other treaty you can get. If you've got a few hated civs, sign trade embargos vs them. I also prefer giving gifts that have 20 turn limits (resources) as opposed to techs or gold.

Since conquests came out the civs seem alot more stable then they did in the past... An ally is alot less likely to turn on you. On monarch difficulty (my first conquest game) as the mayas I attacked and nearly destroyed the byzantines. Just as I was finishing them off the sumerians came after me. I immidiately made peace with byzantine and over about 50 turns I turned them from hostile to my gracious ally (who owned 4 cities ) just gotta be willing to give gifts (I think I gave them 4 techs... writing, lit, construction, and currency. I was around education at the time... So I figured why not?)

1/25/2004 4:24 AM


Conscript Rabbi

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thank you for these insights! I have used a lot of alliances in late game, but exploiting it in early game is a great new challenge!
10/22/2006 5:38 PM
Settler

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10/22/2006 5:27 PM


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How do you stop alliances? I (Arab, Democracy) co-occupy continent with Babilonians and Persians. After long war have all Bab cities but much war weariness. Have good trade deal with Spanish, but they alley with Persians and trade deal goes away. I stop and reload last turn, make my own alliance with Spanish. Shortly I attack Persians (attempt to capture their coal and saltpeter) capture two cities and then we agee on peace treaty. I need this to get me folks happy again and to get more units into postion. The Spanish though keep dragging me back into war and countering the war weariness is costing me big time!! I reloaded this turn several times and can't seem to find any means short of perhaps attacking the Spanish, which of course won't help with the general populatons mood.

Any ideas?

10/22/2006 7:16 PM


sweetP

sweetP

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Welcome to the boards, Mr. Ed

The long and short of it is that only two things stop alliances: time, and war.  Or, well, peace. 

Alliances last for twenty turns.  You have three options, only one of them will leave your reputation intact.  You have to wait for the deal to run out of time, then you can cancel it with no hard feelings.

You can get peace with your enemy, and that will cancel the alliance, but leave your partner pretty miffed at you.  You'll find that it is now pretty expensive to get another nation to ally with you, as they saw you turn your back on your "friend".

Or worse, you can declare war on you "ally", and he will want your corpse burned at the stake after hacking all your limbs off.  No nation in their right minds will ever sign an alliance with you after you do this.  Your best friends might, maybe, if they really hate the guy you want the alliance for, but even then it'll cost you an arm and both legs.

10/22/2006 10:17 PM


Residing President

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3/14/2010 5:06 PM


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Oh geez.
I simply have to post in a thread that Seared posted in. You're like a diety in my memory from way back when I first joined here.

My thoughts on alliances and the like? Uhm, I don't think you can really form "alliances" with Civilization AI. Sure, you can sign treaties with them for 20 turns at a time that keep them somewhat pacified, but it's not really an alliance. They could still attack you at any moment.
But, yes, you seem to have an effective strategy.
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