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| | Bismarcko' Magnifico
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11/16/2008 2:20 PM
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| Option A. Pass my draft into law and there will actually be something the Senate does in regards to game play. Also, we need to get Mr G into the Supreme Court before we can talk about limiting its size. After this is done, I would be more then willing to rewrite my thoughts on the introduction of a "Clerk" to include Tosk's idea into the scheme of our current setup.
In regards to disbanding the Senate and making it part of the citizen body:
Personally, going with allowing every citizen the right of the senator, is down right boring and would kill my own interest. It would not have the end result of keeping more people interested, and in my mind, could lead to more stalls in events where people disagree (heck, look at how we are now in this discussion). There's that familiar "too many cooks in one kitchen" truth in the back of my mind.
The primary need is a simplified way for the senate to actually become involved in the game... my draft allows that (or at the very least, the beginning step towards that direction). I'll also bring up another corny line: "A flat ocean doesn't attract surfers," so I'm still stead fast in demanding the Senate be allowed to generate waves via my proposed draft. |
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-Of course we must all fear evil men, but there is another evil that we must fear more… and that is the indifference of good men.
-New term started, $1,425 (US) for classes, let's see how much books will run up to. MEH.
Edited: 6/11/2007 3:33 AM by Bismarck2990 |   |  |
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G'day
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Yesterday @ 6:20 AM
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| | Hey Biz, Your constitutional amendment regarding Senate giving authority for the president to continue every 10 turns was voted on here: http://www.1bcciv.com/Topic2238112-86-1.aspx And passed.  We just need a justice to actually write the amendment into the constitution. Psweet also raised a motion to shrink the Senate, which has been passed: http://www.1bcciv.com/Topic2238184-86-1.aspx So basically we need to: 1.) Get MM or replacement Justice to add these amendments into the Constitution. 2.) Determine text and propose reduction of size of supreme court, and position of clerk. Technically, the SC Justice should be putting these constitutional amendments to the people, but as MM said, the current votes should be given assent into the constitution to keep the game moving. |
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C3C Emperor
C4BTS Prince
"You can't stop the world from spinning around. You'll never stop the rain from falling down." - St Paul, The Rembrandts
"You may be a king or a little street sweeper, but sooner or later you dance with the Reaper." - Grim Reaper, Bill and Ted's Bogus Journey
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DG: Hopeful Wanderer
 
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10/3/2008 12:02 PM
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die with honor
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Today @ 5:31 AM
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| One last thought ... as it appears that the "government" is sorta moving toward what needed to be done in the beginning.
Every game I have ever been involved in (of this sort) has had a fall back ... some games called it a clerk, some called it the god position, some called it something else. But they always had a position, or person, who kept things moving when things began to stagnate.
Mongoose is attempting to do this, in this game, without overstepping the presidential authority, a tricky line to walk.
IIRC we had to impeach our first two elected presidents in the old DGame before it got moving well ... And eventually we added a clerk there also.
I think a lot of the problem stems not from warlords or vanilla ... but simply the fact that as a game cIV is just not as good/popular overall as civIII was.
Both games have strengths and weaknesses but in popularity civIII was far superior, even at 1BC the expected "traffic" increase did not happen ... to be sure some new people did show up but cIV did not bring in the flood that III did ... and some (far more than with civIII) have just faded away.
I hope BTS will rectify this ... make those who like cIV now become fanatical and bring those of us that are to bored to continue back to a level of enjoyment we expected in the first place. |
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Mine honor is my life; both grow in one:
Take honor from me, and my life is done:
Da Bard ... But something tosk would say.
Americans used to roar like lions for liberty; now they bleat like sheep for security.
~ Norman Vincent Peale~
We don't have to live in the kind of America the two Major parties have in store for us.
Together, let us lay the foundations for an America worthy of our Founding Fathers.
~Ron Paul~
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G'day
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| | Well, hopefully I've got the ball rolling with the Senate Vote for dismissing MM and VC. Next we would have to hold elections to replace the 2 Justices. Do we want to sort out the reform to the Supreme court now, before elections are held? I like the idea of 1 Justice and 1 Deputy Justice/Clerk. Else we have 2 Justices, both of who need to act as clerk? I like the idea of having one "god" member to help out when things get stuck. In this case we need to get our constitutional reforms through without an SC Justice to update the constitution. I would suggest, that, for these reforms only: If no-one else can do it, then Mongoose could update the constitution with the outstanding amendments that MM didn't put through. Alternatively we wait for a new justice to do this. If we need to amend the constitution for changes to the Supreme Court, then again Mongoose could put them through. (If that's ok with you Mongoose?) Once we have the new Supreme Court up and running, then we should fall back to only allowing the Supreme Court to deal with this, else it defeats the point of having them. |
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C3C Emperor
C4BTS Prince
"You can't stop the world from spinning around. You'll never stop the rain from falling down." - St Paul, The Rembrandts
"You may be a king or a little street sweeper, but sooner or later you dance with the Reaper." - Grim Reaper, Bill and Ted's Bogus Journey
<<--- click me! | | | |
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Elite Pathogen
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Yesterday @ 4:20 PM
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| | INTEREST, INTEREST, INTEREST... The biggest problem with these things is that you cannot force interest. People will become involved if there is something to do and something which interests them (ie. it's not a chore and it's fun) and if they have time to devote a few minutes a week/day to do. There is one thing that I think sums up the lack of interest in this game and it's kind of a "been there done that" type of thing. The last 1bc Dgame was so successful (at least that's the impression I got) because it was new and no one had probably done anything quite like it. Well having been involved in two other Dgames already, the novelty's worn off for me. Those who are involved seem to be the ones who weren't involved as much in other Dgames and really want to get it to work. One thing that makes this worse is that the constitution is writen so that it can be reformed as we go along but in doing so, it didn't define enough for the others to do so basically, it needs a leader who will go through and figure out what drastic (and I mean drastic) changes are needed to streamline the system while encouraging participation. All this talk of the last Dgame and trying to replicate it are, I think, why we are struggling so much. It should be nothing like the last Dgame. Get some system which allows everyone to be involved and have some stake in the game. Right now if a monster Civ came along and destroyed our two cities, I'd actually be relieved. This segues into another possible reason for lack of interest, a lack of conflict. There are no civs on our island so it's easy right now. What damage can any half competent president really do (this is not a knock on Goose; you're doing great)? It seems to me that it's when there is some difficulty that people gain interest. Heck, if there was a way to edit this game and plant a civ on our continent, I'd be all for that. Shoot, even make them larger than us and more technically advanced. Point is, there is nothing other than barbs to deal with at the moment. All this could just be my perception and I could be totally off base but combined with the "not enough people having Warlords" thing, has created a lack of interest. My suggestion, scrap the constitution and think outside the box a bit to create something people will want to be involved in, not just that they feel obligated to be involved in. |
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-A government that is powerful enough to do anything for us is powerful enough to do anything to us. -Fred Thompson
-There are two races of people, the decent and the indecent. - Victor Frankel
-They who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security, deserve neither liberty or security. - Benjamin Franklin
Consequences
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sweetP
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2 days ago @ 11:20 PM
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| | I picked the wrong two days to not show up, it seems. You lot have been busy here. My own fiftieth of a dollar: I think there should be a way for citizens to have DIRECT influence on the game. Biz's ammendment IS the first step in the right direction if you ask me, but the Senate's influence will still be indirect and vague (even if it is more of a factor). I think the easiest way to achieve this is make the Senate responsible for creating orders and overseing the direction of certain parts of the empire. Perhaps this can be done in the traditional way (department of commerce/science, department of interior, etc.) or, I've been thinking, geographically (senators control individual cities' production and management and also a certain number of the units produced, for example). Naturally, the first is much easier, and tends to get people who have less time. The second is much more time intensive, and given that the majority of our citizens can't even access the save, it's not even an option in our current state. But either way, I feel that Biz is right. I'm a senator, a princeps even, and I don't feel like I have much influence at all in how the game is run. If it weren't for the fact that I have hope that this can change, I don't think I would even bother being a senator. And yes, using Warlords was a mistake. As I've said from the beginning.  Still, I'd rather be happy than right, and if we can make this work WITH Warlords, I'll be very happy. |
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Emulator of Otto von Bismarck, Master of realpolitik, May he rest in peace.
But the liberals should be careful of screaming too loud ... of conspiring too well ... of undermining us too thoroughly. Because if they succeed, if they do get what they insist they want, then the result may well be something they never conceived ... "They have made a desolation, and they call it peace." ~Tacitus~ ... but a peace controlled by our former enemies.
--Tosk
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