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4/27/2008 1:59 PM


Like the hair cut?

Like the hair cut?

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I am also puzzled how we managed to grab all the important wonders like The Great Lighthouse and many many others. The Pyramids is not that great when you see the amount of shields needed for it. Sure, it's a powerful wonder but the amount of shields needed for in the very early stage will make your civ suffer.
4/27/2008 4:34 PM


Make my day

Make my day

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the amount of shields needed for in the very early stage will make your civ suffer.

Perhaps that's true, but it doesn't explain their total failure to grab at least 50% of the early Wonders. What the heck was going on?

OK, so they got in Pricep: Chitchin Itza, Swedagon Paya, Apostolic Palace and the Pyramids;

in Bismarkia: the temple of Solomon and the Sistine Chapel;

in Cowtown: the Mausoleum (captured, not built)

Omega got every single other Wonder as far as I recall, (or captured it) and even the Sistine chapel was a close-run thing. That should not happen, and even the AI usually does better than that (because of the inbuilt bias at higher levels no doubt)

I can't believe running Representation early was the cause. Surely we have all built the Pyramids in a single game and done that ourselves and survived?

Also, they are not daft. With players like NC on their team, they must have known how to make the best of their situation - and I am convinced Mongoose made the whole thing a level playing-field from the start.

So I am at a loss. I fully expected THEM to investigate us first with caravels. I expected a real race to circumnavigation when we discovered we were on opposing continents. I fully expected them to be ahead in tech, and that we would have to fight and steal to catch up.

As it turned out, it was all so much easier than anticipated.

I will be very interested to find out, when this is all over, if there was a single factor or defining moment that marked the beginning of the end for Alpha (if only so that we can all avoid it in the future!)

Or maybe it was simply a matter of the system of government?

4/27/2008 7:26 PM


Impeached by a patch

Impeached by a patch

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As for why we lead in tech, my simple guess is that they still suffer, to an extent, from Civ3 production improvement hangover. In Civ3, building terrain improvements for commerce was neither necessary nor possible, unlike Civ4. By the time we made first contact with them, our gold output was significantly higher than theirs, but we were about even in industrial output, despite us having conquered Korea and having more cities than them.

As for the Pyramids, it's a powerful wonder in principle, but it's hardly a something-for-nothing. To make the best use of Representation, one needs to focus on food and employ specialists.
4/28/2008 11:58 AM


Wrong

Wrong

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It's right there, isn't it: They focused on hammers, instead of on commerce (for financial) or food (for specialists). I think the Pyramids were largely wasted on them(; I even recall saying something to that end right after they built it..).

We had some nice luxuries that helped keep us afloat financially; does alpha have high commerce luxuries?

Other than that, I think we realized early on that it would be a battle of the seas, and that we could spare the hammers to go a little wonder crazy. I particularly liked the Great Lighthouse, which I do not often build. That too helped keep us afloat when we had three or four cities too many.
5/4/2008 11:43 PM


Impeached by a patch

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Not perhaps a direct reason, but another testament to Alphan ineptitude can be seen by checking out the state of their vassals. Investigate some of their cities, and tell me what you see. They're swimming in their own crap, with little food resources to provide health. The Vikings don't even have iron, that being the reason for them building caravel upon caravel. I mean, what does Alpha benefit from withholding surplus resources from their vassals? They don't have any corporations, so multiples of the same resource are wasted on them.
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